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Episode 181
AI Didn't Ruin Your Ads with Steve Babcock
83% of ad executives now use AI in the creative process, up from 60% two years ago. But only 45% of young consumers feel positive about AI-made ads. Advertisers guess that number is 82%.
This week, Elena and Angela are joined by Chief Creative Officer Steve Babcock to dig into that gap. Cost efficiency is now the top reason marketers reach for AI. It ranked fifth two years ago. Steve explains where AI slop really comes from, why TV punishes cut corners far more than social does, and what still has to stay human. Plus, why cutting production costs means improving the smallest line item on the page.
Topics Covered
• [01:40] Why cost efficiency became AI's top-cited benefit
• [04:00] Where AI slop comes from and the uncanny valley
• [11:50] Should brands disclose when an ad was made with AI?
• [15:00] How AI shows up in briefs, idea generation and pretesting
• [22:15] Why TV is the least forgiving channel for AI creative
• [27:30] The case for raising the creative ceiling, not lowering the price floor
• [30:30] Steve's contrarian take on creating with AI
Resources:
2026 IAB and Sonata Insights Study
Today's Hosts
Elena Jasper
Chief Marketing Officer
Angela Voss
Chief Executive Officer
Steve Babcock
Chief Creative Officer
Transcript
Elena: I'm Elena Jasper. I'm on the marketing team here at Marketing Architects, and I'm joined by my co-host, Angela Voss, the CEO at Marketing Architects.
Angela: Hello.
Elena: Hello, and we're joined by Steve Babcock, our Chief Creative Officer at Marketing Architects.
Steve: This is my third time on the pod.
Angela: You're a pro.
Steve: Happy to be back. I love it. Thank you for having me.
Elena: Of course. Something's going right to return for a third time.
Angela: He wouldn't have been called back.
Steve: Either that or your other guest fell through, but I'm happy to pinch hit.
Angela: Nobody else we could talk to today.
Elena: Yes, you are the number one pick for sure. Perfect. Well, we are back with our thoughts on some recent marketing news, always trying to root our opinions in data, research, and what drives business results. And today we're talking about using AI for your advertising creative. New research shows that consumers, especially Gen Z, are getting more negative about AI-generated advertising right as adoption really explodes.
Now, anyone who listens to this podcast knows that we are big believers in AI for creative. We use it every day, from writing to pre-testing to production, so we're not here to tell you that AI is ruining advertising. We're here to talk about how brands should think about this research and make smart decisions about using AI for their creative strategy.
But I'm gonna kick us off, as I always do, with some research. This is from the IAB and Sonata Insights, and it's titled "The AI Ad Gap Widens." They surveyed over 500 Gen Z and millennial consumers and about 100 ad industry executives. 83% of ad executives say their company has now deployed AI in the creative process, up from 60% just two years ago.
But there's a perception gap. 82% of executives believe young consumers feel positive about AI-generated ads when only 45% actually do, and that gap has widened since 2024. Gen Z is the most skeptical. 39% feel negative about AI ads, nearly double the rate of millennials, and 30% describe brands that use AI for ads as inauthentic.
When marketers are asked why they're using AI, cost efficiency is now the number one benefit. That was cited at 64%. That ranked fifth in 2024. So the motivation has shifted from making better work to making cheaper work, and consumers may be responding to that. Even the IAB's own recommendation is to use AI to enhance creative quality rather than to produce assets just more cheaply.
And that distinction, cheap versus smart when using AI, is something I want to talk about today. So Steve, thanks again for joining. Let's start with the big finding here, that cost efficiency jumped from the fifth-ranked benefit of AI to number one in two years. Does that shift surprise you?
Steve: No, not at all, right? As the technology continues to advance and kinda permeate all the different parts of the creative process, I can see where it's easy to start to think of it as cost-cutting, corner-cutting, just an efficiency in terms of money. I've fallen into that trap myself at times where I'm like, "Oh, okay, maybe we've got a particular situation and the budget's tight, AI." Let's face it, every agency out there is trying to figure out how to survive and create more affordably. So this is, I guess, foreshadowing. I think it's a huge mistake and shortsightedness to just think of it as a cost-cutting solution, for sure.
But I'm not surprised at all.
Angela: Yeah, I agree with you. I think there's a lot of pressure for brands, for agencies. We talk about it on the podcast every week, trying to measure everything down to every last click. That's all in the spirit of being prudent with our dollars, and that feels like a stronger pressure than maybe it was in prior years, in the Mad Men days of get this big idea together and go do this massive shoot, and it was fun, but it was also a time in which it was a lot harder to track back what works and what doesn't.
And so, this could be perfect timing, perfect storm, I don't know which one, just in terms of the efficiency and the cost savings approach through use of AI in the creative world.
Elena: Yeah, so you both mentioned a couple of things there that make me think of this next topic I wanna cover, which is AI's getting easier to use, so more people are producing creative. There's this push towards efficiency, and that's leading to this word that is now used a lot, which is AI slop, and a lot of AI advertising is being put in that bucket.
Steve, do you think that's fair that AI creative is largely, quote-unquote, slop?
Steve: I don't think you can just look at it as advertising creative, right? Because AI, there's sort of the halo effect of how AI is being created and consumed in the world, right? And so slop, as I've ever understood it, refers to — 'cause there's a lot of AI that's kinda like the dangerous stuff, right? The deepfakes and the things like that out in the world that have a massive halo effect. But I think, yes, 100%, there is so much AI slop in the advertising space. I see it every day. My son, which is really funny, we should've had him on the podcast too, a Gen Z. Actually, he might be... what's the next one? Gen Alpha?
Angela: Alpha, I —
Steve: He's 16. Yeah. But he's in there, and any time a commercial will come on that's just bad AI, you know, we both get mad. But he's very upset about it, but I'm just like, that is — And I get mad maybe because it's like I actually believe that there's a future using these tools, and it sort of upsets me when I see it being done very lazily. But yeah, it's... The thing right now is, and we've seen it with other technologies, there's a thing called the uncanny valley, if you're familiar with that term, right? The film industry really picked up on the uncanny valley, right when, like, CGI, kinda pre-Pixar, right?
They would make these, like, animated versions of people but try to make them real, and people didn't like it. And they realized, like, "Oh, wait, we have to find like a different medium where the viewer knows it's not real," and that allows them to be comfortable with it.
And I think a lot of AI right now, maybe not right now, but it's coming out of it, is in the uncanny valley, especially with like humans, right? When you create a human using AI video technology, in a lot of cases it just doesn't sit right. And that is what I would say is slop. It takes effort.
It takes effort to work the system, work the prompts, work the platforms to get things out of that valley to where they're like, "Oh, okay, that is acceptable. That looks realistic. That looks good. That doesn't make me sort of roll back as a consumer." So there's that, and then there's just quite frankly, a lot of people who aren't trying, right?
There's that idea of like, "Oh, I can... It's AI. I can just ba-ba-ba-ba-ba," and that works. And I think as we roll forward, you're going to see, just as you do with every new innovation, the cream of the crop will rise and the slop will go down. But it is, it's new and everyone's using it, and everyone's excited.
And just as when you democratize anything, you kinda go through this era of slop. I do cringe a little bit with it just because I'm like, "That could be a lot better if you cared a little bit more, if you just focused a little bit more." There's a craft to AI creative and I think a lot of marketers are just kinda like, it's the same old thing with like designers when they're just like, "Oh, so and so got his nephew to make the logo." You know? It's just —
Elena: Same problem.
Steve: Um, so yeah. Yeah.
Elena: Yeah, I think you make a good point too, Steve, that slop is also, like AI production in general is impacted by what's happening in the broader use of AI, and there is a lot of like slop on LinkedIn, like people posting content that's clearly AI or images that are... So that all kind of like adds in, and then you see a spot on TV that looks like AI, and it's, you're also like judging it through the lens of feeling like you're seeing that content everywhere.
Steve: But on the flip side though, we've all seen things that are obviously AI, right? It's not a secret. Or even a post where the headline was, "This is AI," that literally blew all of our minds.
Angela: Well, and I would say the flip side of that too is there is a lot of really bad creative out there that is not —
Elena: That's not...
Angela: And, for some reason, we don't care about that.
Steve: Yeah. There is just slop in general.
Angela: Why are we not talking about that? Yeah.
Steve: That's very true. Very.
Elena: Yeah, it doesn't get people as mad for some reason as AI. So one of the, probably I guess the headline from this study is this idea that Gen Z is more judgmental of AI. 30% called brands using AI inauthentic. But I'm curious, Steve, do you think that consumers, especially younger consumers, actually care about, like, how the ad was made, or only whether it's good? Like, where do you think that's kinda coming from?
Steve: I believe we're in a little bit of a transitional period where it's still, like I said, it comes with some baggage, so I think there's probably a little bit of emotion tied to it there. But at the end of the day — I mean, I also believe that it's gonna — the technology is with us and it's exciting and we're just at the beginning, and it's gonna get so much more amazing.
And so I do — I kinda feel like we're in that little mode of like, "It's different, so I kind of wanna resist it or not like it." And again, to your point, it does have a halo effect of some genuinely negative aspects of AI. But at the end of the day, like I was saying, if it's good, it doesn't matter how it's made, right?
And that's like, to my point earlier, we've all seen those examples that get celebrated by all generations 'cause it's like, "Whoa, you used a technology and did something that I've never seen before and brought me all kinds of emotion and entertainment, and that's so amazing." But it's the laziness, it's the slop stuff that I think that probably is what's really turning people off. I don't think the medium is what makes you inauthentic or authentic, right? I mean, there's so much behind it, and what happens before a pixel is moved or a prompt is entered will make a brand authentic or not. But yeah, I hear it a lot. Like I said, I hear it from my son and some of his friends where they're at these formative years and AI probably sits in the back of all their heads of like, "What does this mean for my future?"
Right? More so than maybe us older people who are kinda like, not you, Elena or Ange, me. These older people that are like, "Hey, I feel like I maybe can coast the backside of the effects it's gonna have on humanity." But I think it's totally fair and I think it's important to create with that understanding if Gen Z is your audience, right? Always create with the understanding of your audience. But I don't subscribe — It doesn't scare me, I guess.
Angela: This reminds me of the purpose movement.
Steve: Yeah. Yeah.
Angela: You've got, whether it's Gen Z or Gen X, it doesn't really matter, but this idea that there's a greater mission that marketing and advertising has. And so how an ad comes to be, AI or not, or what a brand stands for really matters to a set audience. We know what happened with the purpose movement, largely just completely fell apart because what does actually care mean, regardless of who the audience is? Actually care. I care about how an ad is made because I think it's inauthentic or, you know, that the creatives of the world are having to change kind of how they bring an idea to life and how does that impact them, but where are my dollars going?
Steve: Mhm.
Angela: You know, you saw a lot of brands step back from the purpose movement and what they were doing because there was no tie between what consumers were saying about what they cared about and where they were actually putting their dollars.
Elena: One other thing that came through in this survey, which I — Sometimes I question, you know, sometimes you ask people questions in a survey, like, and bringing up brand purpose, if you ask people, "Do you care about brand purpose?" in a survey, they say yes. Do they actually? No, not as much as they say they do.
Well, this survey, they asked if knowing an ad was AI-made would have an effect on their likelihood to purchase. And 73% of young people said it would either increase it or have no effect. So they're basically saying, "Hey, you should tell us. It's not gonna — It's gonna make us feel better."
Steve, should — do you think brands should do that? Like, should brands proactively disclose? And some of this is being decided for brands because now there's more, like, automatic disclosures happening on Instagram, and I've seen that in TV ads. But do you think brands should proactively disclose that when they're using AI to create their —
Steve: It's a really good question. And you may recall, I mean, maybe it's a year ago, we kinda went through this topic a little bit of like, wait a minute. I guess I would say sure, right? I guess my general notion is like, don't try to hide something. There's no need to like try to hide it.
And again, like you would go like, "Well, why hasn't this ever happened before with like animation or CGI or other things that weren't human?" I think it's because this is the first time it's so realistic that... And again, it's being used negatively outside in the world for nefarious purposes that can bleed over.
And so I guess if the idea of AI has that nefarious baggage potentially, that, I wouldn't see the harm necessarily in acknowledging it, you know, in creative ways. I mean, when we were back looking at it as it like, is it a legal line that nobody reads? And we were actually talking about like, "No, let's come right out front and be like, 'Man, we proudly created this with AI technology.'"
You know? Like I think that's gotta be the attitude. If you're gonna use AI, like it's positive, it's optimistic, it's exciting because it's allowing you to do things maybe you weren't able to do before. But I think when you try to be sneaky about it, that's probably why, again, and I don't think anyone in advertising is like doing anything nefarious, but it comes with that you're in that shadow, right?
Of it like, "Oh, AI." I don't know. Ange, I'd be really curious what your thoughts are on this because I think why not? Be honest, be transparent, be true.
Angela: I think people appreciate transparency and especially right now. I think there's an opportunity there for people to just own what they do regardless of what it is. I do think this is gonna go away.
Steve: A million —
Angela: Like, if you saw a dragon created with CGI right now, you'd be like, "Really?"
Elena: This is not a real dragon.
Angela: You'd be like, "A disclaimer I didn't know I needed today." So we're kind of in this moment of in between the old world and the new world, and I just think that as we move into the new world more officially, this is just not gonna be as big of a topic.
Steve: Agreed.
Elena: Yeah, I agree with both of you. All right, so we've covered some of the current drama around AI. Let's talk about practically how marketers could use it. Steve, could you talk through, like, how AI is showing up in our creative process? Like, what is it doing right now to make your work better for your teams?
Steve: Wow, what is it not doing? I don't wanna toot any horns here, but I'm really, really proud of where our creative team is in this journey. And it's not something we started yesterday. We've been really at it for a couple years now. I mean, it's really everywhere, right? Starting from brief creation, right? Actually understanding business problems, utilizing agents to help us really dig in and find insights. It's helping there. It's helping with actual idea generation. And I think what's really key, though, the thing that we're really focused on, especially this year, it's kinda one of our goals.
Previous goals have kinda been like figure out the tools, right? Figure out how to work this stuff. And now it's really fun because we're like, "Now let's find the harmony between our skills as humans and our value and our ideas and our tastes and the technology." And so there's like this fun harmony that's starting to happen, and it's very natural.
And so AI ends up kinda becoming like your, almost like your little work partner in a sense, like your concepting partner. And so we have some proprietary tools that we work with that are like — that basically mimic that sort of setup of, like, being able to work with different creatives, synthetic creatives, and you're like, "Okay, well, when I get this, I really like that idea," and da da da.
And it's actually a lot of fun. And then ultimately you come up with the idea. I still fundamentally believe always, no matter how far we go into space and AI and technology and all those things, the idea is gonna be really important, right? Because that idea is human-built, and it wants to connect with another human.
It's grounded in storytelling and emotion. And we come up with those ideas, and one of my favorite parts is previously you would go, "Okay, I have an idea. I've sold it to the client. They like it." Human subjectivity is at play here. We'll maybe go spend a lot of money and sit behind some one-way mirror thing and watch some random people say if they like it or not for some quote-unquote testing, then make some changes, and off we go.
And you know what? You kind of are, like, praying that it does well. Now with ScriptSooth, I'm assuming the audience has heard of that tool, hopefully. If not, look it up. It's amazing, right? We've created this synthetic ability based on years and years of in-market data that well predates my time at Marketing Architects. We're able to then put these awesome ideas that we love into this tool, and it helps us make sure that this will actually perform the way that you need it to. It's not just like black and white. There's usually a process of like, "Hey, what you have now doesn't hit it. Try this, try that."
So there's some working back and forth. Sometimes you can get just like working with a partner, you get a little frustrated. You're like, "No, I like this thing." But the more you create that relationship with AI, you end up going, "Okay, now I've got a piece of creative that is true to my heart and true to performance, and this is awesome and really exciting."
And ever since we put that into effect, right? I mean, out of its beta and once we've had it for, like, probably at least the last year where it's been really part of the process, like we have not had to optimize from in-market.
Angela: Yeah, which really kinda changes the game of a campaign when you think about, okay, where do we go next? Or how do you double down on a message that's already working versus trying to figure out how to fix it?
Steve: Yeah. And previously, my whole career was trying to figure out how to fix it, you know? It was so often that — And so that part's really great, right? And that's kind of the stuff no one sees, and maybe it's the not, quote-unquote, "sexy stuff," right? Then you get into that stuff, and we have built, and we continue to build actually using things like Claude Code, being able to take existing platforms, especially like Midjourney, Runway, et cetera, kind of those classic video creation AI platforms.
And maybe every department's different, but we're like: "Here's how ours works. Here are the things we need." And the process is surprisingly similar in that it borrows from the traditional approach, right? So if you're going through a production, it's pretty classic. You've sold a script through, so I've taken us to that point. Now you need to work with the client on making sure that the style is correct, the casting, their wardrobe, right? The way that shots are gonna be blocked, the music, all those things. That's still very much there.
So if I'm a visual creative, if I'm an art director or designer and I'm part of this process, I'm coming in and I'm utilizing AI, but I'm developing like, "Oh, here's my cast. Here's my characters. Boom, boom. I want this style, I want this style." And you're able to, just like the old format, we're able to work with a client to go make sure, step one, do we like these things?
You know, are we hitting the mark on the target, et cetera. And then those things all get built into a system, and then it's just let the playing begin. You got your cast of characters, you got your look, you got everything in there, and then you're just like, you get to create this awesome world, and edit the world and change the world and optimize the world.
Whereas in the old way, it was like you had eight-hour shoot day, you flew out to LA, you shot it, and whatever you had in the can was what you had. And I think that's the ultimate unlock of AI. Wherever we are in the progress of how people feel about it, but it is endless possibilities, that's why I think it's really exciting. And so the process is kinda similar in terms of like expertise and inputs from humans, but way easier.
Elena: Steve, is there anything in the creative process that you still won't hand to AI? Like, where does the human have to stay in charge in order for the work to be great?
Steve: I think by far the notion of human inventiveness or taste, I'm not gonna say it's something that AI can or can't do, but I have found that, like, that's the combination. When I bring the idea or bring the intuition into the process and then allow AI to help me make that so rapidly, that seems to be like the sweet spot.
I find too, maybe outside of the industry a little bit, I feel like a world where if everybody just said, "Prompt, do this, click, do it," it would create a very beige world. Because by nature of what AI is doing, right, is it's pulling what exists out in the world and resurfacing it.
So that taste — There's a thing called the human leap. It's like where humans are able to invent the thing that doesn't exist. I believe that's the actual scientific phrase for it, the human leap. And that's gotta stay in there. And it can be easy. It can be easy just to be like, "I don't know, AI's so good at this." It's so fast, you know? Like, let me just click and make it do it. But we have a great team here. There's a woman named Viv. She's been on the podcast. She is so good at the taste part. And where even sometimes where I may be like, "Gosh, we're in a hurry. Let's go quickly," da, da, da. And she's very good reminder of like, "Hold up.
Is this as interesting as it can be? Are we feeding it? Are we helping AI with something that's interesting enough or strategic enough or emotional enough?" So I would say taste. I don't know if there's any other word for it, but that seems to be the word that keeps coming to mind.
Elena: Yeah, I think it's definitely important to have tastemakers. I think we've all seen by now that AI is not going to magically make you a strategic creative. And human in the loop, a lot of people say that, it's really not a catchphrase. I think it's really, really important. Well, let's bring in our TV lens, because the study shows that 56% of advertisers are now using AI for TV ads, and TV is really the biggest stage, but it also has, I think, the least forgiveness for cut corners or things like AI slop. Should brands think about AI and TV creative differently than in social or display?
Steve: Absolutely. In the same way that you would think about any other way of production, right? You wanna create appropriate to the channel. So if you're making TikToks, what's appropriate for that platform? How is that content engaged with, et cetera, versus TV? TV still is really that big format.
It really is that cinematic special format. It's also less forgiving, for sure. And we as people, we still operate under that belief, which I think is appropriate, that if it's on TV, that's a TV commercial. That's a brand.
And back to where we were talking a little bit about slop, this is the place you can't have slop. You shouldn't anyway, and occasionally we'll see a TV commercial with slop, AI slop, and you're like, "Why?" I mean, I would hope you wouldn't do it anywhere, but you have more license in the social channels.
But don't cut those corners. Spend that time, finesse, use your craft, make sure the idea is interesting, et cetera, but more so than not.
Angela: I would agree with you, Steve. It feels like when I try to think about best use case for AI in different channels and you just throw all of that into the digital bucket versus television, like, in my head, AI is an opportunity to do what you normally couldn't —
Steve: Mhm.
Angela: In television. So whatever that might be. If we put a, like a purple elephant in a living room, you know, where you'd be like, "Well, that was a cool idea, but it's really expensive, and I don't wanna deal with the CGI or whatever," now you've got this, like, world of possibility to really dream up those new ideas and actualize them in a really cool way. Then on the digital side, it's like use AI to do what you don't wanna do. It's like, how do you, you know, push that down to all your channels, make sure it shows up in your website, and you've got this consistency in terms of a user experience, but you've got hundreds of different versions that you gotta go create in the digital space.
And so that putting AI together in both of those channels, using them differently should take the idea further and make it more effective across channels. But that's kinda how I think about it.
Steve: Totally.
Elena: Yeah, there's definitely more of a spotlight on your brand when you're on the TV stage, but regardless of the channel, putting out slop for your brand really risks how you're perceived, and part of that problem is, quite frankly, exacerbated because AI has crashed the cost of making ads, which means now everyone can afford to make more of them. So Steve, if volume and polish are cheap, what actually becomes a scarce, valuable thing in creative?
Steve: I think it's still the same, and I think it's the idea behind the production. I think regardless of whether it's a full shoot, whether it's shot on a phone, whether it's created completely in a computer, time and time again has always shown us that if the idea is interesting, if it's based on a real consumer insight and it's speaking emotionally and there's interesting storytelling involved, like that's always gonna be the thing that we connect with.
Secondarily is how it's delivered to us. Now, obviously, if it's so poorly done, it will distract from that good idea. If I have a good idea and it is just horrible slop AI or man, it's such shoddy camera work that it made me dizzy, whatever, like that'll detract. But for the most part, if your idea is really, really strong and resonant, like the way that it's produced is a little bit secondary, and that's maybe...
So I think that's why you'll often hear the phrase like concept is king or the idea is king. I just think it's the important part. I'll call it the hook. There's hooks in books and music and things like that, and there's also hooks in storytelling, and as long as you always honor the hook, right?
Every decision you make in production, as long as it doesn't erode the hook, you're always honoring it, you're always doing something to support it, you'll end up with something really strong. So I think it, again, it's the idea, it's the hook. But in a world that's new of AI and still growing, there's still a lot of stuff you can't do very well.
I do see a lot of advertisers dishonoring the hook because they're just like, "Well, that's kinda the best I can do," and then you get distracted with, again, that uncanny valley thing sneaks in and you're like, "Ha ha, this just makes me feel weird. I don't like it."
Elena: I really love how your team focuses on the big idea, and AI is giving the humans on your team more time to dedicate to that important part of creative, which is really only gonna make the work better. So Ange, we've invested heavily in AI across the agency, but not primarily to cut costs. So from your perspective, what's the business case for using AI to raise the ceiling on creative rather than just lower the floor on price?
Angela: We need to be thinking about where our investment is actually going. You know, production is a single-digit percentage of a brand's total marketing investment. Media is a major percentage of that marketing investment. So if you're using AI to just cut production costs, you're kind of optimizing the smallest line item on the page. Rather, if you're using AI to make the creative better, to get that big idea and change the outcome of your business, you know, you're improving the return on that entire media budget. And cost savings aren't a moat, right? Every agency or brand gets basically the same tools at the same time, and so that advantage gets kinda competed away and handed to the — I don't know. It just, it just feels like thinking bigger with AI is where it's at. We didn't use AI to make the ads cheaper.
We bought in on this idea to get more shots on goal, more ideas explored, more concepts pre-tested before a dollar of media goes out the door. More chances to find that idea that actually moves the business, I think is the right way to think about it, so.
Elena: So some of the most talked about ads of the last year were AI created, like Coke's famous holiday spot, and they actually leaned into making it look like it was AI made. So Steve, what do you think of the strategy of really leaning into the fact or exposing the fact that your spot was created with AI?
Steve: Maybe there was a time and a place for it, and I guess I'm — what I'm saying is maybe we're almost over that time and place, right? It used to be a headline.
It was like, "Are you just the first person to make it?" And it — something like Coke, and I remember that holiday, you know, that, that was a headline. And part of their, part of, I would imagine, part of that strategy was, "We're gonna make our sort of annual spot, our holiday spot, and we're gonna do it through AI, and that's gonna get a lot of pickup," which it did. So that was probably part of that whole thing. I don't know... Well, that ship has sailed, I think. That getting the headline for making a spot out of AI is we're past that. We're doing it. So I don't think that's necessarily the strategy. Now it's the strategy of making the better spot that's made out of AI, making the more interesting spot, making the Super Bowl spot. Making, you know, it's like, it's just trying to level that up.
But I, yeah, a million percent, I think it is a badge of honor to be able to work with tools that are not easy. They're not intuitive. They're always, you know, it's such a foreign, it's still such a foreign technology of like, how do I work with this intelligence? How do I prompt it? How do I get it to...
It's not cut and dry. Ask anybody who's good at it. It's a whole language and a whole art form. So I think the game is on, like I'm really excited as we move forward of like who's gonna start really commanding this language and making the stuff that goes down in the annals of advertising for the next 50 years, so.
But just thinking of it as the headline, like we made it with AI, that ship has sailed. Now it's gotta be made really great. Who's gonna level it up?
Angela: Totally.
Elena: I personally love the Coca-Cola holiday spots. I hope they air them even earlier this year. I just found it delightful, but just my opinion. So Steve, I'd like to end with something spicy. What is your most contrarian opinion about AI and creativity?
Steve: Oh boy. Well, you know that I am Mr. Contrarian, so always got a contrarian view. I don't know if this continues to be contrarian, but it's pretty simple. AI. I love creating with it. I think it is amazing, and it is contrarian because there's so many people that want to make a point about never using it, and that's fine.
That's not the point I'm making, but I guess it is contrarian. I feel like the benefits far outweigh the cons. It is so incredibly freeing and it's just fun to create with. And every day it gets better and better and better. And for a lot of folks, maybe like myself, who have been doing this for, you know, a couple decades now, it's like, it's new.
It's new again. And so I guess that's my contrarian view is like, it is a blast. You can let stuff go. Of course there are some things with AI in general that I guess I just sort of trust the world will sort out. But in my world now, like this is — If you are not focusing on this and jumping in and learning to enjoy it, I don't know if it's a matter of you'll be left behind or whatever, but I think you're missing out on just a creative spark that's possible there.
So I'm 110% into it. It is a blast.
Elena: Yeah, I really think that sort of mindset is gonna be necessary to make the most of these tools going forward. But to wrap us up here today, what is the last piece of creative work, this could be an ad or something else, that genuinely made you jealous? For me, I really get jealous whenever I see a brand getting to use distinctive assets or a creative campaign that they have invested years in, and they're still keeping it fresh.
So for example, I love the LiMu Emu. When I see a Liberty Mutual commercial, that makes me jealous. I'm jealous of Mayhem. I'm super jealous of Progressive's Becoming Your Parents campaigns. Really anything that, of where you can see brands, like, reusing their distinctive assets or things that they've invested in over time, I just find very impressive. In fact, we got a mail piece the other day, and I didn't even see the brand, but I saw the hot pink and I was like, "That's T-Mobile." And I thought, "I'm jealous of the fact they've owned a color," because we've covered research on this show before that shows it's really difficult to own a color as a distinctive asset, which makes sense. But they've really got that hot pink, and they use it well. So I would consider myself jealous of that.
Steve: A lot makes me jealous, but in a good way. I feel I've got — Yes, I've gotten old enough to where I can — It doesn't have to keep me up at night. There would be work that used to, like really bother me because I didn't come up with it. But I've worked through that trauma. The one that came, comes to mind is a video, and you'll have to look it up, or I don't know if we link in the show notes or whatever, but it was the Wuffy AI dog.
I don't know if you remember that. It was a fake ad. It actually caused a little controversy 'cause it was so well done that there were some people that were like, "Wait, is this real?" Or whatever. But it was a great spot, made, and the whole idea was that the product was puppies.
They were dogs. And it, so it was like a kind of a, like a testimonial kind of commercial, and it was all about how dogs — Like kind of equating dogs to medication, right? To older people and people who ha — And it was just so well done, so funny, so well-written, and it's dogs. It was adorable, and it was so based on truth of like puppies, dogs are the cure to everything.
And it was called the Wuffy AI Dog. And I remember when I saw that, that was one of the things that A, it made me jealous, but it also, it made me really hopeful 'cause I was like, "Yep, idea's there." The writing, the craft, the thought was there. And yes, the creators of this had a great command of the technology 'cause this one's even maybe, it maybe is a year old.
So back then it was really hard to make stuff look as good as it did. And if you ever need a smile, Google the Wuffy AI dog commercial 'cause it is just yes, it's —
Angela: I missed that one. I don't know if I saw it, so I'm —
Steve: I'll send it to you. I'll send it to you. It's —
Angela: I'll have to go check it out. This one was kinda hard for me. You know, I, maybe it's just working in the field for a long time and you see rounds and rounds of Super Bowl spots and stuff, and it all kinda starts to run together. But I don't have a specific piece of work that made me jealous. I think we do great work for our clients. But I will say that this time that we're in has been interesting just in terms of who's got the leg up, what's the tool of the week or the tool of the month as new models roll out and we all remember ChatGPT releasing first and we're just like, "Oh my gosh," like it's just a total game changer.
They're always gonna be the king, and then all of a sudden it was like, whoa, we've got some Runway players and Midjourney players and Seedance came out, you know. So I think it's been more moments like that where some of those tools, depending on where they're originating from, you know, you might go, "Oh, I'm not sure that it makes great sense for brands here in the US to be using that or agencies to be using it."
But the models are evolving and improving so fast that it doesn't really give me heartburn like it used to. You just kinda gotta, you know, hit the snooze button and wait a couple weeks and there's something else. So, it does really feel like, I mean, the days with the spaghetti video with Will Smith versus where we are now are just unbelievable advancement and in a very short period of time, so it's really fun to think about, you know, where will we be in a year or three years from now.
Steve: I love it. I'm reminded of the phrase that you've heard me say sometimes, and I stole it from somebody, but delusional optimism I think is such a great way to approach AI. It's very easy to get super negative or scared or just be like, "This is amazing, and it's gonna equate to an amazing future." And that's the way to do it.
Angela: It's just a great way to approach life in general. Like, if you can just default to that quadrant of, you know, your options for your job, your personal life, your marriage, your children, whatever,
Steve: There you go.
Angela: Just go there. Yep.
Elena: All right, Steve. Well, thank you so much for joining us. It has been a pleasure having you on the show again. Hope to have you on again soon.
Steve: Awesome.
Episode 181
AI Didn't Ruin Your Ads with Steve Babcock
83% of ad executives now use AI in the creative process, up from 60% two years ago. But only 45% of young consumers feel positive about AI-made ads. Advertisers guess that number is 82%.
This week, Elena and Angela are joined by Chief Creative Officer Steve Babcock to dig into that gap. Cost efficiency is now the top reason marketers reach for AI. It ranked fifth two years ago. Steve explains where AI slop really comes from, why TV punishes cut corners far more than social does, and what still has to stay human. Plus, why cutting production costs means improving the smallest line item on the page.
Topics Covered
• [01:40] Why cost efficiency became AI's top-cited benefit
• [04:00] Where AI slop comes from and the uncanny valley
• [11:50] Should brands disclose when an ad was made with AI?
• [15:00] How AI shows up in briefs, idea generation and pretesting
• [22:15] Why TV is the least forgiving channel for AI creative
• [27:30] The case for raising the creative ceiling, not lowering the price floor
• [30:30] Steve's contrarian take on creating with AI
Resources:
2026 IAB and Sonata Insights Study
Today's Hosts
Elena Jasper
Chief Marketing Officer
Angela Voss
Chief Executive Officer
Steve Babcock
Chief Creative Officer
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Transcript
Elena: I'm Elena Jasper. I'm on the marketing team here at Marketing Architects, and I'm joined by my co-host, Angela Voss, the CEO at Marketing Architects.
Angela: Hello.
Elena: Hello, and we're joined by Steve Babcock, our Chief Creative Officer at Marketing Architects.
Steve: This is my third time on the pod.
Angela: You're a pro.
Steve: Happy to be back. I love it. Thank you for having me.
Elena: Of course. Something's going right to return for a third time.
Angela: He wouldn't have been called back.
Steve: Either that or your other guest fell through, but I'm happy to pinch hit.
Angela: Nobody else we could talk to today.
Elena: Yes, you are the number one pick for sure. Perfect. Well, we are back with our thoughts on some recent marketing news, always trying to root our opinions in data, research, and what drives business results. And today we're talking about using AI for your advertising creative. New research shows that consumers, especially Gen Z, are getting more negative about AI-generated advertising right as adoption really explodes.
Now, anyone who listens to this podcast knows that we are big believers in AI for creative. We use it every day, from writing to pre-testing to production, so we're not here to tell you that AI is ruining advertising. We're here to talk about how brands should think about this research and make smart decisions about using AI for their creative strategy.
But I'm gonna kick us off, as I always do, with some research. This is from the IAB and Sonata Insights, and it's titled "The AI Ad Gap Widens." They surveyed over 500 Gen Z and millennial consumers and about 100 ad industry executives. 83% of ad executives say their company has now deployed AI in the creative process, up from 60% just two years ago.
But there's a perception gap. 82% of executives believe young consumers feel positive about AI-generated ads when only 45% actually do, and that gap has widened since 2024. Gen Z is the most skeptical. 39% feel negative about AI ads, nearly double the rate of millennials, and 30% describe brands that use AI for ads as inauthentic.
When marketers are asked why they're using AI, cost efficiency is now the number one benefit. That was cited at 64%. That ranked fifth in 2024. So the motivation has shifted from making better work to making cheaper work, and consumers may be responding to that. Even the IAB's own recommendation is to use AI to enhance creative quality rather than to produce assets just more cheaply.
And that distinction, cheap versus smart when using AI, is something I want to talk about today. So Steve, thanks again for joining. Let's start with the big finding here, that cost efficiency jumped from the fifth-ranked benefit of AI to number one in two years. Does that shift surprise you?
Steve: No, not at all, right? As the technology continues to advance and kinda permeate all the different parts of the creative process, I can see where it's easy to start to think of it as cost-cutting, corner-cutting, just an efficiency in terms of money. I've fallen into that trap myself at times where I'm like, "Oh, okay, maybe we've got a particular situation and the budget's tight, AI." Let's face it, every agency out there is trying to figure out how to survive and create more affordably. So this is, I guess, foreshadowing. I think it's a huge mistake and shortsightedness to just think of it as a cost-cutting solution, for sure.
But I'm not surprised at all.
Angela: Yeah, I agree with you. I think there's a lot of pressure for brands, for agencies. We talk about it on the podcast every week, trying to measure everything down to every last click. That's all in the spirit of being prudent with our dollars, and that feels like a stronger pressure than maybe it was in prior years, in the Mad Men days of get this big idea together and go do this massive shoot, and it was fun, but it was also a time in which it was a lot harder to track back what works and what doesn't.
And so, this could be perfect timing, perfect storm, I don't know which one, just in terms of the efficiency and the cost savings approach through use of AI in the creative world.
Elena: Yeah, so you both mentioned a couple of things there that make me think of this next topic I wanna cover, which is AI's getting easier to use, so more people are producing creative. There's this push towards efficiency, and that's leading to this word that is now used a lot, which is AI slop, and a lot of AI advertising is being put in that bucket.
Steve, do you think that's fair that AI creative is largely, quote-unquote, slop?
Steve: I don't think you can just look at it as advertising creative, right? Because AI, there's sort of the halo effect of how AI is being created and consumed in the world, right? And so slop, as I've ever understood it, refers to — 'cause there's a lot of AI that's kinda like the dangerous stuff, right? The deepfakes and the things like that out in the world that have a massive halo effect. But I think, yes, 100%, there is so much AI slop in the advertising space. I see it every day. My son, which is really funny, we should've had him on the podcast too, a Gen Z. Actually, he might be... what's the next one? Gen Alpha?
Angela: Alpha, I —
Steve: He's 16. Yeah. But he's in there, and any time a commercial will come on that's just bad AI, you know, we both get mad. But he's very upset about it, but I'm just like, that is — And I get mad maybe because it's like I actually believe that there's a future using these tools, and it sort of upsets me when I see it being done very lazily. But yeah, it's... The thing right now is, and we've seen it with other technologies, there's a thing called the uncanny valley, if you're familiar with that term, right? The film industry really picked up on the uncanny valley, right when, like, CGI, kinda pre-Pixar, right?
They would make these, like, animated versions of people but try to make them real, and people didn't like it. And they realized, like, "Oh, wait, we have to find like a different medium where the viewer knows it's not real," and that allows them to be comfortable with it.
And I think a lot of AI right now, maybe not right now, but it's coming out of it, is in the uncanny valley, especially with like humans, right? When you create a human using AI video technology, in a lot of cases it just doesn't sit right. And that is what I would say is slop. It takes effort.
It takes effort to work the system, work the prompts, work the platforms to get things out of that valley to where they're like, "Oh, okay, that is acceptable. That looks realistic. That looks good. That doesn't make me sort of roll back as a consumer." So there's that, and then there's just quite frankly, a lot of people who aren't trying, right?
There's that idea of like, "Oh, I can... It's AI. I can just ba-ba-ba-ba-ba," and that works. And I think as we roll forward, you're going to see, just as you do with every new innovation, the cream of the crop will rise and the slop will go down. But it is, it's new and everyone's using it, and everyone's excited.
And just as when you democratize anything, you kinda go through this era of slop. I do cringe a little bit with it just because I'm like, "That could be a lot better if you cared a little bit more, if you just focused a little bit more." There's a craft to AI creative and I think a lot of marketers are just kinda like, it's the same old thing with like designers when they're just like, "Oh, so and so got his nephew to make the logo." You know? It's just —
Elena: Same problem.
Steve: Um, so yeah. Yeah.
Elena: Yeah, I think you make a good point too, Steve, that slop is also, like AI production in general is impacted by what's happening in the broader use of AI, and there is a lot of like slop on LinkedIn, like people posting content that's clearly AI or images that are... So that all kind of like adds in, and then you see a spot on TV that looks like AI, and it's, you're also like judging it through the lens of feeling like you're seeing that content everywhere.
Steve: But on the flip side though, we've all seen things that are obviously AI, right? It's not a secret. Or even a post where the headline was, "This is AI," that literally blew all of our minds.
Angela: Well, and I would say the flip side of that too is there is a lot of really bad creative out there that is not —
Elena: That's not...
Angela: And, for some reason, we don't care about that.
Steve: Yeah. There is just slop in general.
Angela: Why are we not talking about that? Yeah.
Steve: That's very true. Very.
Elena: Yeah, it doesn't get people as mad for some reason as AI. So one of the, probably I guess the headline from this study is this idea that Gen Z is more judgmental of AI. 30% called brands using AI inauthentic. But I'm curious, Steve, do you think that consumers, especially younger consumers, actually care about, like, how the ad was made, or only whether it's good? Like, where do you think that's kinda coming from?
Steve: I believe we're in a little bit of a transitional period where it's still, like I said, it comes with some baggage, so I think there's probably a little bit of emotion tied to it there. But at the end of the day — I mean, I also believe that it's gonna — the technology is with us and it's exciting and we're just at the beginning, and it's gonna get so much more amazing.
And so I do — I kinda feel like we're in that little mode of like, "It's different, so I kind of wanna resist it or not like it." And again, to your point, it does have a halo effect of some genuinely negative aspects of AI. But at the end of the day, like I was saying, if it's good, it doesn't matter how it's made, right?
And that's like, to my point earlier, we've all seen those examples that get celebrated by all generations 'cause it's like, "Whoa, you used a technology and did something that I've never seen before and brought me all kinds of emotion and entertainment, and that's so amazing." But it's the laziness, it's the slop stuff that I think that probably is what's really turning people off. I don't think the medium is what makes you inauthentic or authentic, right? I mean, there's so much behind it, and what happens before a pixel is moved or a prompt is entered will make a brand authentic or not. But yeah, I hear it a lot. Like I said, I hear it from my son and some of his friends where they're at these formative years and AI probably sits in the back of all their heads of like, "What does this mean for my future?"
Right? More so than maybe us older people who are kinda like, not you, Elena or Ange, me. These older people that are like, "Hey, I feel like I maybe can coast the backside of the effects it's gonna have on humanity." But I think it's totally fair and I think it's important to create with that understanding if Gen Z is your audience, right? Always create with the understanding of your audience. But I don't subscribe — It doesn't scare me, I guess.
Angela: This reminds me of the purpose movement.
Steve: Yeah. Yeah.
Angela: You've got, whether it's Gen Z or Gen X, it doesn't really matter, but this idea that there's a greater mission that marketing and advertising has. And so how an ad comes to be, AI or not, or what a brand stands for really matters to a set audience. We know what happened with the purpose movement, largely just completely fell apart because what does actually care mean, regardless of who the audience is? Actually care. I care about how an ad is made because I think it's inauthentic or, you know, that the creatives of the world are having to change kind of how they bring an idea to life and how does that impact them, but where are my dollars going?
Steve: Mhm.
Angela: You know, you saw a lot of brands step back from the purpose movement and what they were doing because there was no tie between what consumers were saying about what they cared about and where they were actually putting their dollars.
Elena: One other thing that came through in this survey, which I — Sometimes I question, you know, sometimes you ask people questions in a survey, like, and bringing up brand purpose, if you ask people, "Do you care about brand purpose?" in a survey, they say yes. Do they actually? No, not as much as they say they do.
Well, this survey, they asked if knowing an ad was AI-made would have an effect on their likelihood to purchase. And 73% of young people said it would either increase it or have no effect. So they're basically saying, "Hey, you should tell us. It's not gonna — It's gonna make us feel better."
Steve, should — do you think brands should do that? Like, should brands proactively disclose? And some of this is being decided for brands because now there's more, like, automatic disclosures happening on Instagram, and I've seen that in TV ads. But do you think brands should proactively disclose that when they're using AI to create their —
Steve: It's a really good question. And you may recall, I mean, maybe it's a year ago, we kinda went through this topic a little bit of like, wait a minute. I guess I would say sure, right? I guess my general notion is like, don't try to hide something. There's no need to like try to hide it.
And again, like you would go like, "Well, why hasn't this ever happened before with like animation or CGI or other things that weren't human?" I think it's because this is the first time it's so realistic that... And again, it's being used negatively outside in the world for nefarious purposes that can bleed over.
And so I guess if the idea of AI has that nefarious baggage potentially, that, I wouldn't see the harm necessarily in acknowledging it, you know, in creative ways. I mean, when we were back looking at it as it like, is it a legal line that nobody reads? And we were actually talking about like, "No, let's come right out front and be like, 'Man, we proudly created this with AI technology.'"
You know? Like I think that's gotta be the attitude. If you're gonna use AI, like it's positive, it's optimistic, it's exciting because it's allowing you to do things maybe you weren't able to do before. But I think when you try to be sneaky about it, that's probably why, again, and I don't think anyone in advertising is like doing anything nefarious, but it comes with that you're in that shadow, right?
Of it like, "Oh, AI." I don't know. Ange, I'd be really curious what your thoughts are on this because I think why not? Be honest, be transparent, be true.
Angela: I think people appreciate transparency and especially right now. I think there's an opportunity there for people to just own what they do regardless of what it is. I do think this is gonna go away.
Steve: A million —
Angela: Like, if you saw a dragon created with CGI right now, you'd be like, "Really?"
Elena: This is not a real dragon.
Angela: You'd be like, "A disclaimer I didn't know I needed today." So we're kind of in this moment of in between the old world and the new world, and I just think that as we move into the new world more officially, this is just not gonna be as big of a topic.
Steve: Agreed.
Elena: Yeah, I agree with both of you. All right, so we've covered some of the current drama around AI. Let's talk about practically how marketers could use it. Steve, could you talk through, like, how AI is showing up in our creative process? Like, what is it doing right now to make your work better for your teams?
Steve: Wow, what is it not doing? I don't wanna toot any horns here, but I'm really, really proud of where our creative team is in this journey. And it's not something we started yesterday. We've been really at it for a couple years now. I mean, it's really everywhere, right? Starting from brief creation, right? Actually understanding business problems, utilizing agents to help us really dig in and find insights. It's helping there. It's helping with actual idea generation. And I think what's really key, though, the thing that we're really focused on, especially this year, it's kinda one of our goals.
Previous goals have kinda been like figure out the tools, right? Figure out how to work this stuff. And now it's really fun because we're like, "Now let's find the harmony between our skills as humans and our value and our ideas and our tastes and the technology." And so there's like this fun harmony that's starting to happen, and it's very natural.
And so AI ends up kinda becoming like your, almost like your little work partner in a sense, like your concepting partner. And so we have some proprietary tools that we work with that are like — that basically mimic that sort of setup of, like, being able to work with different creatives, synthetic creatives, and you're like, "Okay, well, when I get this, I really like that idea," and da da da.
And it's actually a lot of fun. And then ultimately you come up with the idea. I still fundamentally believe always, no matter how far we go into space and AI and technology and all those things, the idea is gonna be really important, right? Because that idea is human-built, and it wants to connect with another human.
It's grounded in storytelling and emotion. And we come up with those ideas, and one of my favorite parts is previously you would go, "Okay, I have an idea. I've sold it to the client. They like it." Human subjectivity is at play here. We'll maybe go spend a lot of money and sit behind some one-way mirror thing and watch some random people say if they like it or not for some quote-unquote testing, then make some changes, and off we go.
And you know what? You kind of are, like, praying that it does well. Now with ScriptSooth, I'm assuming the audience has heard of that tool, hopefully. If not, look it up. It's amazing, right? We've created this synthetic ability based on years and years of in-market data that well predates my time at Marketing Architects. We're able to then put these awesome ideas that we love into this tool, and it helps us make sure that this will actually perform the way that you need it to. It's not just like black and white. There's usually a process of like, "Hey, what you have now doesn't hit it. Try this, try that."
So there's some working back and forth. Sometimes you can get just like working with a partner, you get a little frustrated. You're like, "No, I like this thing." But the more you create that relationship with AI, you end up going, "Okay, now I've got a piece of creative that is true to my heart and true to performance, and this is awesome and really exciting."
And ever since we put that into effect, right? I mean, out of its beta and once we've had it for, like, probably at least the last year where it's been really part of the process, like we have not had to optimize from in-market.
Angela: Yeah, which really kinda changes the game of a campaign when you think about, okay, where do we go next? Or how do you double down on a message that's already working versus trying to figure out how to fix it?
Steve: Yeah. And previously, my whole career was trying to figure out how to fix it, you know? It was so often that — And so that part's really great, right? And that's kind of the stuff no one sees, and maybe it's the not, quote-unquote, "sexy stuff," right? Then you get into that stuff, and we have built, and we continue to build actually using things like Claude Code, being able to take existing platforms, especially like Midjourney, Runway, et cetera, kind of those classic video creation AI platforms.
And maybe every department's different, but we're like: "Here's how ours works. Here are the things we need." And the process is surprisingly similar in that it borrows from the traditional approach, right? So if you're going through a production, it's pretty classic. You've sold a script through, so I've taken us to that point. Now you need to work with the client on making sure that the style is correct, the casting, their wardrobe, right? The way that shots are gonna be blocked, the music, all those things. That's still very much there.
So if I'm a visual creative, if I'm an art director or designer and I'm part of this process, I'm coming in and I'm utilizing AI, but I'm developing like, "Oh, here's my cast. Here's my characters. Boom, boom. I want this style, I want this style." And you're able to, just like the old format, we're able to work with a client to go make sure, step one, do we like these things?
You know, are we hitting the mark on the target, et cetera. And then those things all get built into a system, and then it's just let the playing begin. You got your cast of characters, you got your look, you got everything in there, and then you're just like, you get to create this awesome world, and edit the world and change the world and optimize the world.
Whereas in the old way, it was like you had eight-hour shoot day, you flew out to LA, you shot it, and whatever you had in the can was what you had. And I think that's the ultimate unlock of AI. Wherever we are in the progress of how people feel about it, but it is endless possibilities, that's why I think it's really exciting. And so the process is kinda similar in terms of like expertise and inputs from humans, but way easier.
Elena: Steve, is there anything in the creative process that you still won't hand to AI? Like, where does the human have to stay in charge in order for the work to be great?
Steve: I think by far the notion of human inventiveness or taste, I'm not gonna say it's something that AI can or can't do, but I have found that, like, that's the combination. When I bring the idea or bring the intuition into the process and then allow AI to help me make that so rapidly, that seems to be like the sweet spot.
I find too, maybe outside of the industry a little bit, I feel like a world where if everybody just said, "Prompt, do this, click, do it," it would create a very beige world. Because by nature of what AI is doing, right, is it's pulling what exists out in the world and resurfacing it.
So that taste — There's a thing called the human leap. It's like where humans are able to invent the thing that doesn't exist. I believe that's the actual scientific phrase for it, the human leap. And that's gotta stay in there. And it can be easy. It can be easy just to be like, "I don't know, AI's so good at this." It's so fast, you know? Like, let me just click and make it do it. But we have a great team here. There's a woman named Viv. She's been on the podcast. She is so good at the taste part. And where even sometimes where I may be like, "Gosh, we're in a hurry. Let's go quickly," da, da, da. And she's very good reminder of like, "Hold up.
Is this as interesting as it can be? Are we feeding it? Are we helping AI with something that's interesting enough or strategic enough or emotional enough?" So I would say taste. I don't know if there's any other word for it, but that seems to be the word that keeps coming to mind.
Elena: Yeah, I think it's definitely important to have tastemakers. I think we've all seen by now that AI is not going to magically make you a strategic creative. And human in the loop, a lot of people say that, it's really not a catchphrase. I think it's really, really important. Well, let's bring in our TV lens, because the study shows that 56% of advertisers are now using AI for TV ads, and TV is really the biggest stage, but it also has, I think, the least forgiveness for cut corners or things like AI slop. Should brands think about AI and TV creative differently than in social or display?
Steve: Absolutely. In the same way that you would think about any other way of production, right? You wanna create appropriate to the channel. So if you're making TikToks, what's appropriate for that platform? How is that content engaged with, et cetera, versus TV? TV still is really that big format.
It really is that cinematic special format. It's also less forgiving, for sure. And we as people, we still operate under that belief, which I think is appropriate, that if it's on TV, that's a TV commercial. That's a brand.
And back to where we were talking a little bit about slop, this is the place you can't have slop. You shouldn't anyway, and occasionally we'll see a TV commercial with slop, AI slop, and you're like, "Why?" I mean, I would hope you wouldn't do it anywhere, but you have more license in the social channels.
But don't cut those corners. Spend that time, finesse, use your craft, make sure the idea is interesting, et cetera, but more so than not.
Angela: I would agree with you, Steve. It feels like when I try to think about best use case for AI in different channels and you just throw all of that into the digital bucket versus television, like, in my head, AI is an opportunity to do what you normally couldn't —
Steve: Mhm.
Angela: In television. So whatever that might be. If we put a, like a purple elephant in a living room, you know, where you'd be like, "Well, that was a cool idea, but it's really expensive, and I don't wanna deal with the CGI or whatever," now you've got this, like, world of possibility to really dream up those new ideas and actualize them in a really cool way. Then on the digital side, it's like use AI to do what you don't wanna do. It's like, how do you, you know, push that down to all your channels, make sure it shows up in your website, and you've got this consistency in terms of a user experience, but you've got hundreds of different versions that you gotta go create in the digital space.
And so that putting AI together in both of those channels, using them differently should take the idea further and make it more effective across channels. But that's kinda how I think about it.
Steve: Totally.
Elena: Yeah, there's definitely more of a spotlight on your brand when you're on the TV stage, but regardless of the channel, putting out slop for your brand really risks how you're perceived, and part of that problem is, quite frankly, exacerbated because AI has crashed the cost of making ads, which means now everyone can afford to make more of them. So Steve, if volume and polish are cheap, what actually becomes a scarce, valuable thing in creative?
Steve: I think it's still the same, and I think it's the idea behind the production. I think regardless of whether it's a full shoot, whether it's shot on a phone, whether it's created completely in a computer, time and time again has always shown us that if the idea is interesting, if it's based on a real consumer insight and it's speaking emotionally and there's interesting storytelling involved, like that's always gonna be the thing that we connect with.
Secondarily is how it's delivered to us. Now, obviously, if it's so poorly done, it will distract from that good idea. If I have a good idea and it is just horrible slop AI or man, it's such shoddy camera work that it made me dizzy, whatever, like that'll detract. But for the most part, if your idea is really, really strong and resonant, like the way that it's produced is a little bit secondary, and that's maybe...
So I think that's why you'll often hear the phrase like concept is king or the idea is king. I just think it's the important part. I'll call it the hook. There's hooks in books and music and things like that, and there's also hooks in storytelling, and as long as you always honor the hook, right?
Every decision you make in production, as long as it doesn't erode the hook, you're always honoring it, you're always doing something to support it, you'll end up with something really strong. So I think it, again, it's the idea, it's the hook. But in a world that's new of AI and still growing, there's still a lot of stuff you can't do very well.
I do see a lot of advertisers dishonoring the hook because they're just like, "Well, that's kinda the best I can do," and then you get distracted with, again, that uncanny valley thing sneaks in and you're like, "Ha ha, this just makes me feel weird. I don't like it."
Elena: I really love how your team focuses on the big idea, and AI is giving the humans on your team more time to dedicate to that important part of creative, which is really only gonna make the work better. So Ange, we've invested heavily in AI across the agency, but not primarily to cut costs. So from your perspective, what's the business case for using AI to raise the ceiling on creative rather than just lower the floor on price?
Angela: We need to be thinking about where our investment is actually going. You know, production is a single-digit percentage of a brand's total marketing investment. Media is a major percentage of that marketing investment. So if you're using AI to just cut production costs, you're kind of optimizing the smallest line item on the page. Rather, if you're using AI to make the creative better, to get that big idea and change the outcome of your business, you know, you're improving the return on that entire media budget. And cost savings aren't a moat, right? Every agency or brand gets basically the same tools at the same time, and so that advantage gets kinda competed away and handed to the — I don't know. It just, it just feels like thinking bigger with AI is where it's at. We didn't use AI to make the ads cheaper.
We bought in on this idea to get more shots on goal, more ideas explored, more concepts pre-tested before a dollar of media goes out the door. More chances to find that idea that actually moves the business, I think is the right way to think about it, so.
Elena: So some of the most talked about ads of the last year were AI created, like Coke's famous holiday spot, and they actually leaned into making it look like it was AI made. So Steve, what do you think of the strategy of really leaning into the fact or exposing the fact that your spot was created with AI?
Steve: Maybe there was a time and a place for it, and I guess I'm — what I'm saying is maybe we're almost over that time and place, right? It used to be a headline.
It was like, "Are you just the first person to make it?" And it — something like Coke, and I remember that holiday, you know, that, that was a headline. And part of their, part of, I would imagine, part of that strategy was, "We're gonna make our sort of annual spot, our holiday spot, and we're gonna do it through AI, and that's gonna get a lot of pickup," which it did. So that was probably part of that whole thing. I don't know... Well, that ship has sailed, I think. That getting the headline for making a spot out of AI is we're past that. We're doing it. So I don't think that's necessarily the strategy. Now it's the strategy of making the better spot that's made out of AI, making the more interesting spot, making the Super Bowl spot. Making, you know, it's like, it's just trying to level that up.
But I, yeah, a million percent, I think it is a badge of honor to be able to work with tools that are not easy. They're not intuitive. They're always, you know, it's such a foreign, it's still such a foreign technology of like, how do I work with this intelligence? How do I prompt it? How do I get it to...
It's not cut and dry. Ask anybody who's good at it. It's a whole language and a whole art form. So I think the game is on, like I'm really excited as we move forward of like who's gonna start really commanding this language and making the stuff that goes down in the annals of advertising for the next 50 years, so.
But just thinking of it as the headline, like we made it with AI, that ship has sailed. Now it's gotta be made really great. Who's gonna level it up?
Angela: Totally.
Elena: I personally love the Coca-Cola holiday spots. I hope they air them even earlier this year. I just found it delightful, but just my opinion. So Steve, I'd like to end with something spicy. What is your most contrarian opinion about AI and creativity?
Steve: Oh boy. Well, you know that I am Mr. Contrarian, so always got a contrarian view. I don't know if this continues to be contrarian, but it's pretty simple. AI. I love creating with it. I think it is amazing, and it is contrarian because there's so many people that want to make a point about never using it, and that's fine.
That's not the point I'm making, but I guess it is contrarian. I feel like the benefits far outweigh the cons. It is so incredibly freeing and it's just fun to create with. And every day it gets better and better and better. And for a lot of folks, maybe like myself, who have been doing this for, you know, a couple decades now, it's like, it's new.
It's new again. And so I guess that's my contrarian view is like, it is a blast. You can let stuff go. Of course there are some things with AI in general that I guess I just sort of trust the world will sort out. But in my world now, like this is — If you are not focusing on this and jumping in and learning to enjoy it, I don't know if it's a matter of you'll be left behind or whatever, but I think you're missing out on just a creative spark that's possible there.
So I'm 110% into it. It is a blast.
Elena: Yeah, I really think that sort of mindset is gonna be necessary to make the most of these tools going forward. But to wrap us up here today, what is the last piece of creative work, this could be an ad or something else, that genuinely made you jealous? For me, I really get jealous whenever I see a brand getting to use distinctive assets or a creative campaign that they have invested years in, and they're still keeping it fresh.
So for example, I love the LiMu Emu. When I see a Liberty Mutual commercial, that makes me jealous. I'm jealous of Mayhem. I'm super jealous of Progressive's Becoming Your Parents campaigns. Really anything that, of where you can see brands, like, reusing their distinctive assets or things that they've invested in over time, I just find very impressive. In fact, we got a mail piece the other day, and I didn't even see the brand, but I saw the hot pink and I was like, "That's T-Mobile." And I thought, "I'm jealous of the fact they've owned a color," because we've covered research on this show before that shows it's really difficult to own a color as a distinctive asset, which makes sense. But they've really got that hot pink, and they use it well. So I would consider myself jealous of that.
Steve: A lot makes me jealous, but in a good way. I feel I've got — Yes, I've gotten old enough to where I can — It doesn't have to keep me up at night. There would be work that used to, like really bother me because I didn't come up with it. But I've worked through that trauma. The one that came, comes to mind is a video, and you'll have to look it up, or I don't know if we link in the show notes or whatever, but it was the Wuffy AI dog.
I don't know if you remember that. It was a fake ad. It actually caused a little controversy 'cause it was so well done that there were some people that were like, "Wait, is this real?" Or whatever. But it was a great spot, made, and the whole idea was that the product was puppies.
They were dogs. And it, so it was like a kind of a, like a testimonial kind of commercial, and it was all about how dogs — Like kind of equating dogs to medication, right? To older people and people who ha — And it was just so well done, so funny, so well-written, and it's dogs. It was adorable, and it was so based on truth of like puppies, dogs are the cure to everything.
And it was called the Wuffy AI Dog. And I remember when I saw that, that was one of the things that A, it made me jealous, but it also, it made me really hopeful 'cause I was like, "Yep, idea's there." The writing, the craft, the thought was there. And yes, the creators of this had a great command of the technology 'cause this one's even maybe, it maybe is a year old.
So back then it was really hard to make stuff look as good as it did. And if you ever need a smile, Google the Wuffy AI dog commercial 'cause it is just yes, it's —
Angela: I missed that one. I don't know if I saw it, so I'm —
Steve: I'll send it to you. I'll send it to you. It's —
Angela: I'll have to go check it out. This one was kinda hard for me. You know, I, maybe it's just working in the field for a long time and you see rounds and rounds of Super Bowl spots and stuff, and it all kinda starts to run together. But I don't have a specific piece of work that made me jealous. I think we do great work for our clients. But I will say that this time that we're in has been interesting just in terms of who's got the leg up, what's the tool of the week or the tool of the month as new models roll out and we all remember ChatGPT releasing first and we're just like, "Oh my gosh," like it's just a total game changer.
They're always gonna be the king, and then all of a sudden it was like, whoa, we've got some Runway players and Midjourney players and Seedance came out, you know. So I think it's been more moments like that where some of those tools, depending on where they're originating from, you know, you might go, "Oh, I'm not sure that it makes great sense for brands here in the US to be using that or agencies to be using it."
But the models are evolving and improving so fast that it doesn't really give me heartburn like it used to. You just kinda gotta, you know, hit the snooze button and wait a couple weeks and there's something else. So, it does really feel like, I mean, the days with the spaghetti video with Will Smith versus where we are now are just unbelievable advancement and in a very short period of time, so it's really fun to think about, you know, where will we be in a year or three years from now.
Steve: I love it. I'm reminded of the phrase that you've heard me say sometimes, and I stole it from somebody, but delusional optimism I think is such a great way to approach AI. It's very easy to get super negative or scared or just be like, "This is amazing, and it's gonna equate to an amazing future." And that's the way to do it.
Angela: It's just a great way to approach life in general. Like, if you can just default to that quadrant of, you know, your options for your job, your personal life, your marriage, your children, whatever,
Steve: There you go.
Angela: Just go there. Yep.
Elena: All right, Steve. Well, thank you so much for joining us. It has been a pleasure having you on the show again. Hope to have you on again soon.
Steve: Awesome.